{"id":6407,"date":"2017-10-13T07:39:58","date_gmt":"2017-10-13T11:39:58","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/jenniferbooher.com\/wp-walking\/?p=6407"},"modified":"2017-12-19T18:22:17","modified_gmt":"2017-12-19T23:22:17","slug":"interview-rodney-eason-at-thuya-landing","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"http:\/\/jenniferbooher.com\/wp-walking\/interview-rodney-eason-at-thuya-landing\/","title":{"rendered":"Interview: Rodney Eason at Thuya Landing"},"content":{"rendered":"
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Looking back at Asticou Landing and Terraces from the dock.<\/em><\/p><\/div>\n

The Coast Walk is entering an experimental phase. I mentioned in my last post that I received a Kindling Fund grant<\/a> this year to help with the cost of transcribing interviews. Usually I talk to people while we are hiking a section of coast, and then write an essay weaving that discussion around the photos and narrative of the walk. Well, I need to use up my grant money by the end of the year, and that won’t happen with my current pace of obtaining permissions for these hikes (about 6 months per mile) so I’ve started interviewing people like mad, wherever and whenever they are willing to meet. I’m going to present the interviews to you as they happen, and tie them back into the Coast Walks when I pick up that thread again.<\/p>\n

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Rodney Eason, CEO of the Land & Garden Preserve<\/a>, was good-natured enough to be my first guinea pig<\/del> volunteer. The Preserve manages the Asticou Azalea Garden, the Thuya Garden and Lodge, the Asticou Terraces (which some of us call “the path up to Thuya”) and the Asticou Landing (also known as “the Thuya Dock.”) As of this year, they also manage the Little Long Pond area. Rodney and I met at the Asticou Landing at 3pm on September 29, 2017. It was 65\u00baF (18\u00baC), sunny, with a light wind from the mouth of the harbor: a gorgeous late-summer day. He had brought a handful of photos from the Thuya archives.<\/p>\n

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Construction of the path and landing, from approximately the same area as the photo below. Photo courtesy of the Land & Garden Preserve.
<\/em><\/p><\/div>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 So, what can I help you with?<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Tell me about these photos.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Sure. We got these from Ken Savage. Ken was Charles [Savage]’s son. … Just to back up a bit. … Joseph Curtis was a Bostonian who set up sort of a rusticator’s colony up Thuya Drive. He had built a procession of houses \u2026 up to the last house, which is now Thuya Lodge. He had envisioned a place for residents of Northeast Harbor and their guests, where they could walk. This was sort of simultaneous to the whole concept of what became Acadia National Park. This movement was afoot. \u2026 Charles Savage was running the Asticou Inn then, [and he] was approached by Curtis to take over the responsibility of the Asticou Terraces. \u2026 There was some money there, and over time he hired crews to build the walkways, which are there now, including this dock, because Curtis had wanted a dock.<\/p>\n

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The path down to Asticou Landing.<\/em><\/p><\/div>\n

We actually have the language of the deed from Curtis that states this dock and float should be open and accessible for the residents of Northeast Harbor. I think he had envisioned people coming over from Northeast Harbor, across the harbor, docking here, coming up the ramp, and then eventually making their way all the way up, \u2026 enjoying the Asticou Terraces.<\/p>\n

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Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Do people do that?<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I would say some people do, and I’m not a good judge of monitoring it, but Rick LeDuc who’s Thuya’s manager said he sees people utilize the space and visit the gardens \u2026 Curtis did not have the gardens. He had an orchard up there. Savage added the gardens in the late fifties. \u2026Those were Beatrix Farrand’s plants from Reef Point.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I didn’t realize that! I knew that they went to the Asticou [Azalea Garden], but<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 If you read his first statement of purpose, which is down in the Rockefeller archives in Tarrytown, New York, his original intent was to move Farrand’s collection to Thuya, because that’s all he had responsibility for. He was trustee of Thuya. So, he had envisioned, ‘we’ll turn Thuya into essentially an Arnold Arboretum for the north,’ because some of the plants at Reef Point had come from Sargent, who was the director of the Arnold Arboretum. [Ed.note: Charles Sprague Sargent https:\/\/en.wikipedia.org\/wiki\/Charles_Sprague_Sargent<\/a> , professor of botany at Harvard University and the founding director of the Arnold Arboretum, was one of Beatrix Farrand\u2019s early mentors.<\/em>]<\/p>\n

When Farrand sold Reef Point to Robert Patterson, Bob Patterson, [he] wanted to sell the plants, where they were going to just demolish them. Charles Savage wrote a proposal to John D. Rockefeller Jr., and said \u2018could I get your financial backing?\u2019 Rockefeller gave him the money to move [the plants], and then when he started moving the plants \u2026 he found that Thuya was not large enough. He wrote another proposal to Rockefeller saying, \u2018here’s my vision for Asticou [Azalea Garden],\u2019 which was a swamp.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Wow.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 They sculpted the pond and moved the remaining plants from Farrand’s collection to there. Anyway, that’s where Curtis’s [original] vision of having this procession up to the lodge sort of morphed, and Savage added on the garden to it. He’s the one that hired the crews to build the stone stairs, and the lookouts, and so it’s a combination of both men’s vision.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Which one built the library up there? Isn’t there a botanical library?<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yes. There is. I’m thinking that Savage had a strong hand in the formation of that with the rare volumes and collections. In the Northeast Harbor library, they actually have the trustee’s report, which Savage put together. And it is amazing. The photographs of the gardens being formed.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Oh my god, I’ll have to look for that.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 A lot of these are in that report.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Okay.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 He has ledgers. He has balance sheets. He has everything. Quite exhaustive book. You can go down in the archives and see the original trustee’s report, which outlines that.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I’m going to have to do that.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah. It has the inventory of the rare book collection – I think portions of it were sold prior to Thuya becoming a part of the Land and Garden Preserve. I mean, there were some rare herbals that were in that collection [and are] no longer there.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Okay.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Anyway. I could go on.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Please do. This is fascinating. \u2026 I read [Letitia Baldwin\u2019s book about Thuya] a year or so ago, so I’ve forgotten some of the finer points. …<\/p>\n

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Path to the Asticou Landing. Photo courtesy of the Land & Garden Preserve.<\/em><\/p><\/div>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 This one here [pointing to the photo above<\/em>] \u2026 I find really cool. \u2026This is the ramp we walked down to get here. This was [and] \u2026 is a public way. As I understand it, before Peabody Drive was expanded, and I don’t know when that was done, it was a \u2026 gentler slope, and you can see here, Savage had some vision of a mixed garden. And the garden actually continued, and there was a shelter here as well. These power lines are along Peabody Drive. This was a totally different experience down to the dock and along the shore of North East Harbor. Supposedly, \u2026 there was a walkway, or there was some form of a walkway all the way to Seal Harbor. I don’t know if it followed the coastline, or if it followed Peabody Drive.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It’s interesting. I don’t remember seeing that on any of the old path maps. [Ed.note: I still haven’t been able to find a map that shows it, but I’ve heard about the old path from more people since this interview.<\/em>]<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Again, this is all hearsay that this kept going. The kids could ride their bikes from \u2026 the Asticou Inn or Northeast Harbor – they could follow the sidewalks and go all the way to Seal Harbor.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 That must have been so cool.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yes. There’s a small group of us who are trying to get expanded shoulders on Peabody Drive so we can get bicycle and pedestrian [access], safer access all along. Anyway, knowing that Peabody Drive can’t get wider here because of the slope, it might be interesting to see if this ramp could keep going. And that could resurrect the old walkway.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 That would be great.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah. Then you\u2019d go below Peabody Drive if you\u2019re on a bicycle, and then slope back up and connect on the other side.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 How are the property owners reacting?<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Those that know about it thus far have been great. Anything to have safer access for their families and for their kids, but we haven’t talked to everybody. That’s the next step.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I’ll tell you, talking to everybody takes a lot of time.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It does. But it’s so critical to the process, that’s for sure. We’ve had some along Peabody Drive have just said, “yeah, great idea.” We’ve had no one say no yet.<\/p>\n

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Path to the Asticou Landing. Photo courtesy of the Land & Garden Preserve.<\/em><\/p><\/div>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 This is looking back up [the path]. I think this was gravel. …<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah. It looks like a carriage road, sort of.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I think that’s what it was. I think this surface was gravel as well [the surfacing of the terrace at the dock, which is currently old, cracked asphalt<\/em>]. We’re talking about, in the future, taking this asphalt up and restoring it back to gravel.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 That’d be nice.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah. Changing the overall appearance. [Pointing to another photo.<\/em>] I don’t know exactly where this is.<\/p>\n

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Path near the Asticou Landing. Photo courtesy of the Land & Garden Preserve.<\/em><\/p><\/div>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Wow. It looks like … the path was closer to the water.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Right. This is a really cool photograph.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It’s a beautiful view. It’s kind of a neat railing too.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It looks like Asticou Terrace’s [railing], but then there’s the water. I’m not sure exactly where this was, unless it was a continuation of the pathway past the copper beech there.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah. Have you tried to find that tree?<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 No.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Do you know when the photos were taken?<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 [Charles Savage] took over as trustee in the late twenties. \u2026 It was in sometime in the thirties, would’ve been my guess.<\/p>\n

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Photo courtesy of the Land & Garden Preserve.<\/em><\/p><\/div>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I notice there’s no mechanization in the construction photos. It looks like they’re doing it all by hand here.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Right. I don’t know if there was a steam powered winch that pulled the cables so they could lift the stones or not.<\/p>\n

Ed.note: the original photos are much darker, I’ve brightened these a lot, so you can now see the base of the crane a little. You know me, I went off on an internet hunt for the type of crane that might have been used. It looks a bit like this pre-WWII British hand-driven crane:
\n<\/em><\/p>\n

<\/a>

http:\/\/www.geoffkirby.co.uk\/PortlandArchivePictures\/html\/quarries.html<\/a><\/p><\/div>\n

And here’s a fascinating and only slightly relevant page on the history of human-powered cranes<\/a>.<\/em><\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 And who these guys were, I don’t know if they were the Candages or who [Savage] had employed to do the masonry work. I’m sure that information is buried somewhere and can be found.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 That would be cool to find out.<\/p>\n

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Construction of Asticou Landing. Photo courtesy of the Land & Garden Preserve.<\/em><\/p><\/div>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah. A lot of the work at Seal Harbor was done by Candages. They actually did a lot of the retaining walls that you see around Seal Harbor, but then who did Northeast Harbor? I don’t know.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I\u2019m trying to remember. Was it the Candages who did the Village Green at Seal Harbor?<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I think so.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 There used to be a low retaining wall. It’s kind of buried now. Only the top bit of it still shows. [Ed.note: Yes, it was the Candage firm and there are photos of it in Coast Walk 14<\/a>.]<\/em><\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It’s in that book about Seal Harbor-<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 … that little folio book.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Oh yeah, Remembering Seal Harbor<\/em> or something [Ed.note: Revisiting Seal Harbor<\/em>]<\/p>\n

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Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah. They talk about the Candages, and I think they probably did that wall up by the church. If you’re leaving, if you’re going past the coffee shop on the right, there’s a beautiful stone wall there.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Oh right, when the houses … like when you’re heading out of Seal Harbor. Yeah, that is a beauty.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 That wall keeps going. There’s one right opposite of the store fronts.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Oh. Maybe that’s the one I’m thinking of.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 And then tucked up in the woods is a summer church.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I didn’t know that.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It’s a stucco church that’s only open in the summer time.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Okay.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 You should check it out. It’s beautiful.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I will.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 The other really beautiful stone wall there is the one on that little tiny Farrand garden.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Where’s the Farrand garden?<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 When you’re in the intersection, with the little spring in the middle of it-<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 … just to the right, it steps down. It’s like a little half circle. It’s a memorial to, I think Edward Dunham. [Again, photos of it in Coast Walk 14<\/a>.]<\/em><\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Right above the playground.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 But gorgeous stone work there. If you haven’t been in there, stop some time.<\/p>\n

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Stonework along the Asticou Landing path.<\/em><\/p><\/div>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I’ll take a look. This walkway here… the pathway’s part of Thuya, but along the way, there’s a fence.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I saw that, with the \u2018private\u2019 sign.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 That’s Richard Estes. [Ed.note: https:\/\/en.wikipedia.org\/wiki\/Richard_Estes<\/a> and https:\/\/americanart.si.edu\/exhibitions\/estes<\/a>]<\/p>\n

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Water Taxi, Mount Desert, 1999. Collection of the Kemper Museum of Contemporary Art, Kansas City, Missouri.<\/em><\/p><\/div>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 He’s a painter. In New York. He has the house across the street from Thuya’s parking lot. There’s that white house on the hill, and then he has the dock. The people just adjacent to the parking lot, I met them this summer, and I think they’re from the Philadelphia area. There’s Story Litchfield, and then there’s a house that’s for sale. I want to say, then it’s the Inn.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah. They’ve got three or four of those little cottages, right?<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 [Those] were different Savage homes, and they moved them around. Sam McGee is a great resource. \u2026 Sam wrote that article for the Historical Society. \u2026It talks about how the family moved houses.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 What? I haven’t seen that.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 [About] the Savage family, that whole area of Asticou, \u2026 they would take a home and then add onto it, and so that’s where a whole village of the Savage family was. [Ed.note: “They Should Have Constructed Their Buildings on Wheels,” by Samuel Savage McGee. See bibliography.<\/a><\/em>]<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Neat.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 They would have a winter house. Then in the summer, they’d move back off the street and live in the summer house [Ed.note:<\/em> so they could rent out the big house to the summer people<\/em>.] Then went back to their big house [in the winter.]<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Cool. Sounds like people are still doing that.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It was a precursor to Air B&B.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah. You know, that’s my main income these days.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Is it really?<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Weekly rentals. Yeah. It’s a way to [make a living] on the island, you know?<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 And you’re working with LARK?<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yep. Although less of that now. Brian and I bought the house next door to us about a year and a half ago. \u2026 It was pretty tumbledown, so we’ve been renovating it and renting it out. That’s been taking all my time.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I bet. You doing the renovation yourself?<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 A lot of it. I spent most of yesterday learning how to stop the stairs from creaking.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 How do you do that?<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Apparently the creaking is caused when the various [parts] of the stairs get loosened up over time and rub against each other. I tried a couple of things that didn’t work, so I finally took apart one of the stairs. Pried the tread up as much as I could. [Ed.note:<\/em> So I could see where the stringers were.<\/em>]<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Right.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Then I got really long, finish-head screws-<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Okay.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 … and screwed everything all back together really well.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 And that worked?<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yes. I got rid of like ninety percent of the squeaking.<\/p>\n

\"\"<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I meant to ask you, how did you end up here? You started what, like two years ago?<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Two years ago. Interesting question. We were in Boothbay for three years, working at the botanical gardens down there, and prior to that I was at Longwood Gardens for eight years.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I didn’t know that.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Cool.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I was down there for eight years. It was a great job, but I was ready to do something different. Somewhere else. We had always vacationed up here. Carrie went to college with Sarah Richardson Stanley [Ed.note: Sarah\u2019s a landscape designer and an old friend of both myself and Carrie Eason. She lives on MDI<\/em>. Hi, Sarah!<\/em>] We started vacationing up here in college. Then we went, let’s move [to Maine]. Then the job opened up in Boothbay, and then, I don’t know, two years ago when Carole Plenty was retiring, the reserve hired a head hunter, a search firm. They had gotten my name, and I came up and interviewed and went through the various processes. They offered me the job.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 That’s awesome.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It is awesome.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Kind of flattering to be recruited like that.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Definitely so. The ironic thing is that I was practicing as a landscape architect the first time we came up here, which was 1997. I had been doing some gardens, but not to the extent [I wanted] – intimate spaces in designs make me feel like, yeah I’m glad I’m in this profession. I remember we walked into the Rockefeller garden, and I had been in North Carolina where I was practicing in Raleigh. Our firm was doing parking lot fit-outs [and] warehouses.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Oh god.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Essentially, I was doing planting design by code. For x number of parking spaces you have to have x lineal feet of shrubs. And you have to have x number of trees. You draw a radius around each tree, and there can be no open space from the radius anywhere. I said, ‘I can’t do this, this is not what I went to school for’. When I walked in the Rockefeller garden, I said ‘I want to be in the garden, I need to change my career.’ Then, pretty soon thereafter, I left landscape architecture and went into gardens.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Wow.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah. Now I get to work here, which is really cool.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It’s funny. Over twenty years ago.<\/p>\n

\"\"<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Back to this, is there anything I can help with? Are there any questions you have for me \u2026?<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I think you just gave me some pretty interesting information! What I’m looking for [is hard to explain] … it’s an intersection between the natural history of the place and its cultural history. There’s so much intersection on this island. It’s hard to find a square inch of shore line that hasn’t been used. Colonized. I’m just fascinated with the way \u2026 that people have used the island for making a living, and for recreation, and for things that blur the lines between those. I don’t always know what I’m looking for until I trip over it.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Right. I get it. You talk about tripping over it \u2026 one of the things [I\u2019m interested in is] the Seaside trail, I’m really intrigued by Edward Rand.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 He did the maps, right?<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 And he was the botanist of the Champlain Society. He did the first floristic inventory of Mount Desert Island.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yes. I’m thinking there was a map that went into the book?<\/p>\n

\"\"

“Map of Mount Desert Island, Maine \/ Compiled for The Flora of Mt. Desert Island by Edward L. Rand.” 1893.<\/em><\/p><\/div>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 He had the map commissioned with topography so he could mark where he found the different colonies of plants.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 There’s a lady [who] did an internship or some grant with Acadia National Park. She went back\u00a0 and tried to find some of Rand’s colonies.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Oh, cool.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 And … because of the herbarium samples, and because he mapped everything prior to GPS \u2026 and he gave physical descriptions of where everything was, she tried to extrapolate where he was. She’s showing thirty percent species loss. [Ed.note: Rodney sent me the info later. “The Changing Flora of Mount Desert Island” by Caitlin McDonough MacKenzie, see bibliography below.<\/em>]<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Oh, wow.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 She says, “is this climate change?” It’d be wonderful if someone had the time, and had grant money to not only take Rand’s information with flora, but also take the other information from the Champlain Society related to climate. And be able to say, this is how much things have changed in a hundred and twenty-some years.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Anyway … Going on the Seaside trail, there’s a plaque there.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Wait, which is the Seaside trail?<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 That’s the one you have to go up the private driveway, across from Seal Harbor Beach, west of Stanley Brook Road. It goes up to the Edwards property.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Okay.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 And then if you veer off into the woods, there is a big boulder with a memorial plaque to Edward Rand. It talks about him conducting that first flora of Mount Desert Island.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Wow. I’m going to have to look for that.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah. Yeah.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I didn’t know that was there. …<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 They had to maintain that, for the Seaside trail, because the Seaside trail went, as I understand it, from the hotel \u2026 to the Jordan Highlands. [Ed.note: the old Seaside Inn was in the meadow at the Seal Harbor Beach. See Coast Walk 14 <\/a>for photos.<\/em>]<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah. I didn’t realize it was still there. That’s so cool.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 The trail’s still there. And Acadia National Park worked this summer to restore it, and so they’re actively working on it there.<\/p>\n

\u2026<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Someone who’s really good about knowing where the old trails are is Keith Johnston. He’s in charge of all the trail maintenance for Acadia National Park.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Oh. Wow. Is he still doing that?<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah, he’s based at McFarland Hill. …<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I should talk to him.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 You need to talk to him. Keith’s the one who said … I don’t know how many miles of abandoned trails there are in Acadia National Park. Is there a secret map of abandoned trails?<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 There are a couple of blogs online where people hunt them down and try and tell you how to get to them. But I don’t know of any published maps.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah. Me either. I don’t know if Tom Saint Germain’s working on one or not.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I don’t know. [Ed.note: I actually just heard about a book of abandoned trails, although I haven\u2019t read it yet: The Acadia You Haven\u2019t Seen, by Matthew Marchon.<\/em>]<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I\u2019ve walked the Iron Rung trail, which is Hunter’s Beach. Have you ever been there?<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 No, I haven’t. Where does it start from?<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It starts at Hunter’s Beach, and it goes towards Dick Wolf’s. There’s the old, iron handrails.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Oh! Yeah. I have, actually. It used to be called the Seal Harbor trail or something.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It went all the way around.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah. There’s still a lot of those handrails up there.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Did you do that?<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Some of it, I did. A lot of it, I was actually down on the tide line. I went with Tim [Garrity] from the historical society. Tim and I went exploring over there from Hunter’s Beach. [Ed.note: That was Coast Walk 13<\/a>.<\/em>] Yeah. The funny thing is, the minute you see those handrails … you’re like, village improvement society. Like, nineteen hundred or so.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 There’s just something so characteristic about them.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 That’s so cool to know that that went around. I’d love to [know] if they have similar things over there in Northeast Harbor.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I haven’t done my research over there yet. I’ll let you know if I find anything.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Okay.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I found remnants of the bridges that used to cross some of the gaps in the trail over there. The bridges are long gone, but you can see where the pipes anchoring them were.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Would that have been near the Basses, or where?<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 No. This was more around the point toward Hunter’s Beach. It was probably more like on David Rockefeller’s land there. The part that’s semi-public. There was a lot of the trail still left there.<\/p>\n

\"\"<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Okay.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I got permission [for the Coast Walk] from the next landowner, and \u2026 I think there was some on [that] property too. …<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Nice.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Bits and pieces there.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Wow. Such an interesting place.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I love living here.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Me too. Finding all the old traces, and decoding them.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It’s rich with history.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 The preserve has numerous endowments that help fund the operations of the preserve. Curtis set up an endowment \u2026 that was transferred to Savage when he was trustee. \u2026 That is to help maintain this. It’s modest, but it helps maintain this area, because he wanted it open and accessible to the public.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It’s amazing to me how many people have done things like that on this island. Like, in addition to the Park there are all these little holdings of semi-public access points.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah. I haven’t read anything specific, I’m sure it exists, about the mindset or the ethos at that time. This summer, I read the biography on Alexander von Humboldt by Andrea Wulf<\/a>. Wonderful book. He inspired so many naturalists, including Darwin. When Darwin was doing his research in the mid eighteen hundreds, then of course the intellectuals of Harvard said, “Oh gosh, we can explain things through analysis of our natural ecosystems. We have to go study and explore.\u201c So the Champlain Society was a manifestation of this Darwinian concept of being able to learn nature through observation … I’d like to think that Curtis wanted to promote that. I don’t know that he explicitly did that, or if it was just to convene with nature. You know, Olmsted had that similar philosophy where nature’s what cures you.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 The lungs of the city.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah. Yeah. \u2026 Nature itself is a hospital, and I like to think we live in one gigantic self-healing place.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah. It needs a little bit of care.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 We all do.<\/p>\n

\"\"<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Do you know what I’ve found interesting, is that in the last year, I’ve started to hear more and more professionals on the island start talking about climate change in public lectures. Mary Roper brought it up, when she talked at the Farrand Society.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I was just at John Richards\u2019 and Sam Eliot\u2019s talk [about the book they wrote about Little Long Pond<\/em>.] They were talking about climate change at Little Long Pond … . Are you seeing effects up there [at Thuya]?<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 We were just talking about this. I’ve only been in Maine five years. I love it here … I grew up in North Carolina where you can plant in January, it just never stopped. When I first moved here, people didn’t plant until Memorial Day, and you sort of quit in late September. And I’m thinking, why are we quitting? Then all of a sudden in December everything freezes up and you realize why, but [now] everybody talks about, gosh the season’s really extending here into the fall. We’re seeing the seasons grow longer on the shoulders. I think, of course the red pine scale<\/a> is the canary in the coal mine.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Oh yeah.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 There will be no red pines left on the island. It’s just a matter of what’s next. When we were down on the Boothbay peninsula, there was [an] outbreak of the Hemlock woolly adelgid <\/a>which is slowly making it’s way up the Maine coast. Someone told me, as a measuring stick, that the adelgid cannot survive minus-twenty [degrees], like minus-twenty is the killing point.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Wow. So, we’re not even getting that [cold] anymore.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 No. The adelgid, I think is down near the Camden\/ Rockland area, and slowly making it’s way up. It’s probably just a matter of time before we see the hemlock woolly adelgid on our native hemlock stands. There are only a few of them on the island, but still.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It’s going to be depressing.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It is. It is. [Like] the mid Atlantic when we were in Pennsylvania or even in the south, [where] so much of the native understory now is taken over by invasive exotics, because there’s really not a hard freeze that chokes them out. Here … there’s [still] predominately native vegetation.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I haven’t been hands-on involved with the plantings for a long time, but [as a landscape architect] I was seriously worried about the birch borer, and the viburnum beetle. I had stopped planting the native birches.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It’s tough. That, and you’re right about the viburnum leaf beetle.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Again, in Boothbay, we didn’t really plant viburnum for that reason. It’s nice to come here and see some viburnum.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 But the problem with planting them is that they’re so much more vulnerable when they’re recently planted. It’s the same thing with the birches. The existing stands seem to have more resilience. But if you plant a birch … they just kept getting devastated. The yellows and grays seem to be tougher, but the paper birches, which is what we all love and want, I just stopped planting them. Which made me so sad.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Unfortunately, to deal with that, you either change species or you start using something like Merit, which is an insecticide, and inject the plant.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah. It has to be systemic.<\/p>\n

\"\"<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 At the preserve we don’t use any artificial insecticides or pesticides. … It’s just a matter of species selection. You’re right, either the [plant] palette\u2019s going to get really limited with climate change, or there’s got to be some flexibility, because, I don’t want to get off subject, but people [are against] GMO. I understand that standpoint from a food standpoint, but from a landscape adaptability\/survivability standpoint, there’s got to be some research done with native species. And whether that’s finding certain characteristics of native stands and being able to breed that into others so that it can survive a certain climate, like the National Arboretum has been working for years on survivability of hemlocks<\/a>.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 And elm.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Right.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 The whole … the Patriot elm <\/a>and all that.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 A buddy of mine, who’s the director down there, he’s like, “You want to see a slow process? Get into tree breeding.” Because you can’t release it until like twenty years. You have to breed it, you have to select, and then you have to watch its resistance before you bring it onto the market. He’s like, you could release one or two trees your whole career.<\/p>\n

Yeah, those are some of the things that we’re starting to wonder. I would love to talk with someone who’s, say, at the Bio Lab, who’s looking at things under a microscope. What are the invasive biologicals that we can’t see with our eyes, but we can see under a microscope?<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Oh, that’s a creepy thought.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 How is that microscopic level changing with climate change?<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 The reason I bring that up is, a few years ago I saw at a conference, a lady was talking about diatoms, and she was talking about how there are healthy diatoms in water. She monitors the lakes around Florida and … Florida’s now being overrun with invasive diatoms from bilge water from other countries.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Wow.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 At the microscopic level, the foreign diatoms can actually run out the native diatoms which affects the whole fish life cycle.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah. We’re seeing stuff up here with bryozoans and tunicates<\/a>.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Oh.<\/p>\n

\"\"<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 They’re not microscopic, but they’re fairly small creatures. We’re definitely getting some invasions of those. So yeah, it’s at every scale.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah. Maybe there’s a summit that needs to occur at some point on MDI about the effects of climate change.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Probably wise, because a lot of things are going to happen. Like at the book talk [the other] night, they said just flat out, “When sea level rises, Little Long Pond is going to be a cove.” I was like, wow that’s hard to picture.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah. Depending on what happens with the model. It’d be a tidal response, and what kind of engineering effects would go into place to either abate that or allow the ocean to flow more freely without Peabody Drive being washed out.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 And that would be a trick. You\u2019d need to do a bridge.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I know. I know. I mean, the sea wall holds it back to some extent in the winter time, but that’s managed. A friend of mine is the director of the botanical garden in Oklahoma, and a lot of their funding comes from families connected with petroleum. He cannot mention climate change. He is not allowed to acknowledge it or mention it.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 That must be tough. Do you get any pressure?<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 No.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Good.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Not at all.<\/p>\n

\"\"<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah. I don’t understand how something so fundamental and world-changing has become so politically charged.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I mean, I do understand it, but it seems like even the people who don’t want us to acknowledge it are going to be affected by it. It seems like just self-preservation.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I don’t get it. I don’t get it.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I’m sorry. Didn’t want to go down that path.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 No, that’s fine. I think if anything, thinking about these particular gardens, how’s the aesthetic going to be in the next fifteen to twenty years. I mean, the aesthetics of these gardens are predicated on either the asian style or this English-cottage style.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 With longer seasons or warmer springs or variable temperature fluctuation, I think, if anything, we’ll need to have an area for trial and research if we want to maintain that aesthetic. What are some plants of maybe different cultivars or different species that would be able to maintain that aesthetic, or do we slowly shift the aesthetic to use plants which are more adaptable to this climate? Or the changing climate.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I think you’ll be able to keep the aesthetic in most cases.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Using warmer climate plants.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Sorry. It’s my kid texting me.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Have we taken too long? I know you’ve got a pretty full schedule.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It is four.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It is? Oh my gosh!<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I\u2019ve got to go. [We walked up to the start of the path.<\/em>] Just ignore this bittersweet. One of our projects [as] part of the renewal of this [dock area] is to rethink the landscape, which is this amalgamation of natives and of exotics. It’s interesting that Farrand had dwarf spruce at Reef Point, and at some point Savage or one of his designees repeated that as these sentries. Over time they’re no longer dwarf spruces.<\/p>\n

\"\"<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 They\u2019re a little out of scale now.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 All right. See you later.<\/p>\n

Jenn:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Thank you again.<\/p>\n

Rodney:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 My pleasure.<\/p>\n

\"\"<\/p>\n

WORKS CITED<\/p>\n

Baldwin, Letitia S. Thuya Garden: Asticou Terraces & Thuya Lodge<\/em>. Mount Desert Land & Garden Preserve, 2008.<\/p>\n

MacKenzie,\u00a0Caitlin McDonough, “The Changing Flora of Mount Desert Island<\/a>.” Chebacco<\/em>, volume XVI, 2015.<\/p>\n

Marchon, Matthew. The Acadia You Haven’t Seen<\/em><\/a>. CreateSpace, 2017.<\/p>\n

McGee, Samuel Savage. “They Should Have Constructed Their Buildings on Wheels,” Mount Desert Island: Shaped by Nature<\/em>. Maine Memory Network, April 2013. Date accessed: October 9, 2017. http:\/\/mdi.mainememory.net\/page\/3806\/display.html<\/a><\/p>\n

Vandenburgh, Lydia and Shettleworth,\u00a0Earle G., Jr. Revisiting Seal Harbor and Acadia National Park<\/a>. Arcadia Publishing, 1997.<\/p>\n

Wulf, Andrea. The Invention of Nature: Alexander von Humboldt’s New World<\/a>. Random House, 2015.<\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

ADDENDUM<\/p>\n

Another photo of the path from Asticou Dock to Seal Harbor, looking back at Asticou Dock.<\/p>\n

<\/a>

Photo courtesy of the Great Harbor Maritime Museum, via the Maine Memory Network. “Asticou Dock in Northeast Harbor. This dock is now owned and maintained by the Island Foundation, which also owns the Thuya Gardens and Azalea Gardens. This picture was probably taken by George Fennelly.”<\/a><\/p><\/div>\n

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